Crowd control
-
- April
- 24
I received this e-mail from a parent yesterday, and I wanted to post it here to see if anyone had similar concerns. Have crowds gotten worse recently? Has sportsmanship? Or is the writer out of touch? Are some areas worse than others?
She signed the original e-mail but agreed to let me post it on the blog if she could remain anonymous so as not to embarrass her daughter. Also, I xxx’d out the offending school. Partly because I don’t want this to be an attack on one program, but rather a look at the general scene, and because I’ve actually covered a game at that school this year (which narrows it down if you’ve been paying attention) and I really thought the atmosphere there was better than in at least two other places. If you really think that was the wrong decision I can be convinced. Anyway, here it is:
“My daughter has been playing travel lacrosse since 4th grade. She is now a senior in high school. As such, I am a long time spectator of travel and varsity lacrosse games. In comparison to other varsity sports, I was always impressed with the level of sportsmanship and behavior exhibited by both the players and spectators. That is, until last week in XXXXX. I have to say, I was born and raised in Brooklyn, NY and am by no means unfamiliar with rowdy crowds. But the boorishness of both the XXXXX students, spectators and parents was really surprising. My daughter also commented on the rudeness of the players on the field and I have to say the personal attacks about the visiting team and comments coming from parents sitting around me was bordering on harrassment. I was waiting for a hockey game to break out.”
And later: “I think it’s a shame, especially when teams play away and don’t have much support from the sidelines. It got really painful listening to, “hit the goalie.” It’s one thing to have team loyalty, but as I mentioned, the insults were made to specific players.”
I’d love to hear your thoughts on this.
This entry was posted
on Thursday, April 24th, 2008 at 5:10 pm by Harold Gutmann.
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wow..I won’t waste time hazarding a guess as to where this was because i agree that
this has become widespread lately in the girls game, where as it used to be a friendly
atmosphere. I too am a veteran of the varsity and club world and i think that it is an issue that needs to be addressed. When did it become acceptable to verbally assault a visiting team?? to call opposing team names on the field? Is it up to the AD’S? I will say that when a player is looking to be recruited ,nothing turns a coach off quicker than outspoken nasty
parents commenting on the sidelines and nasty player behavior on the field…..word of warning..you NEVER know who’s watching.
I have to say Harold i haven’t commented on this blog since the witnessing the viciousness at the end of last year, but kudos to you and the letter writer for bringing up a very important topic that needs to be dealt with.
first let’s all admit that the only sporting events regularly attended by numerous high school students are football games and boys basketball games. yes, there are a few exceptions (once in a blue moon) for some exceptional girls teams, but for the most part, the vast majority of spectators at any girls varsity game are the parents of the girls who are playing. if the boys who attend my daughter’s high school deigned one of her lax games worthy of their attendance, i really wouldn’t care how rudely they acted. too bad for the visiting team. it’s called home court advantage. the parents, on the other hand, should shut up.
On vacation I absolutely agree and thank you for clarifying.
Personally, I haven’t heard any bashing of players from parents or fans at any games, just loud rooting which should be allowed. I will say though my daughter told me the trash talking that happens on the field is out of control, not just in lax but in all sports. That I believe is up to the coaches to control. If I was coaching a team and heard one of my players cursing at or nastily talking to an opposing player, or worse a ref, she would be out of the game and on the bench, but I do know many coaches who would do that. I believe the fans should be able to root, even disagreeing with calls, as long as they’re not talking negatively about the players, but, the players should keep their mouths shut and play the game, and the refs and coaches should enforce that.
Ok so trashtalking. It’s almost always going to happen in any sport and it could extend from small comments to outlandish statements. And yes it’s wrong, we all know that, but it takes a great player to be able to let the comments fly by their ears and just play their game. I know during a game, I don’t even hear the fans. You’ve got to be in your zone, so if your head’s not fully in the game than yes these statements are going to hurt you. But a player distracted is a player defeated…
Nothing is going to change unless our Athletic Directors take a more active role in “crowd control”
As a two sport coach in section 1, too often it is up to us to deal with all of the distractions that are happening off the field.
Any “heckler” should be warned then automatically removed if they continue this immature behavior. Once one person starts to berate a ref, opposing player etc.. the masses join in. Unless the A.D. steps in, this behavior just spreads. I challenge our Athletic Directors to take a more active role in dealing with this ongoing problem.
I was at a High School Football game two years ago at Sleepy Hollow High School. One of the Sleepy Hollow players got hurt on a play. A couple parents from the visiting team started to cheer. The person anouncing the game got on the mike and told the parents that it is in-appropiate to cheer when kids get hurt. I will never forget that.
Has nothing else happened in girl’s lacrosse since 4/24? Entries are made daily by the sports writers on the boy’s lacrosse blog – even on a slow or no lacrosse day. Maybe the inequity of coverage gets parents steaming mad and poor game behavior is one way of letting it out. OK, OK, I am never in favor of poor behavior at a game – any game – any age group. I do not want to place blame in any one area – but something that I think will help with crowd control is consistency with the calls from the officials. Calls called the same way for both teams, the entire game. As parents we don’t see all calls but we do see when officials are not consistent. Officials’ more often than not set the tone for a game. This is not an excuse for poor behavior by anyone – but its where I see parents most upset.
allLax,
Agree with you about the boys’ sportswriters. Lombardi and Devaney make entries in their blogs year round. Harold must have read your post. He just added an entry a few minutes ago.
As for the officials, I agree there’s a problem with inconsistency. That’s because girls’ lax has grown so much and so fast in Westchester they can’t train officials fast enough. We have minimally trained officials at all these games.
charger,
I agree with your statement on the trained officials.
Thanks Harold for adding something new – I was about to go blogging with the boys!
Thanks for the comments — I’ll take criticism over nothing, which except for a brave few is what I’ve been getting since the season started.
Ideally, this blog is supposed to be a two-way street, so if there’s ever something you want to discuss, or you can’t wait for another topic, please feel free to start one.
Thanks Harold. What about some updates from last nights games. I have not gotten the paper yet. I heard that L/P beat Greeley by one. What happened with the ‘pac vs jj game? Thanks.
Harold –
Your right – this is a two way street. I am sure that there are plenty that want to blog but may be afraid to voice.
Have you gotten any feed back on how many HV girls will be playing for the national teams?
I heard that there were several great games over spring break, including the one btw Nanuet and Greeley. Anyone have any insights?
Don’t worry – there will be plenty of blog entrees soon when the Empire team is again chosen through nepotism and politics. The current Vegas betting line is 10 – that is the coaches will choose 10 out of the 20 players from their own teams. You can either bet above or below that line for payout. (They will explain they really had no choice – most were either on last years team or needed to be selected because they paid big bucks to be on their club team this year.) Of course, for those who hide their heads in the sand, tryouts will be open and selections made based on talent.
laxlaxlax,
you’re a schmuckschmuckschmuck. guess the silver medal wasn’t good enough for your high standards.
....after all its only the results that count – it doesn’t matter how you play the game. Its too bad that this belief held by many in society on the whole has reached down to high school sports. Integrity – well it can be tossed aside as long as you WIN the game. Winning is important and is the only true barometer ? Ignoring unfairness is Ok – you see this medal ? It somehow proves that the process was ok ? the end justifies the means ? It doesn’t matter who get hurts – because WE WON !
get off your high horse. winning the silver just goes to show that the selections were based on talent last year, not nepotism and politics. hard to believe you’re still harboring a grudge. you might want to seek the help of a professional.
Hey – on vacation
Its pretty funny that under a blog about crowd control and sportmanship that you make 2 entrees where you revert to childish name calling, insults, and personal attacks. Bad timing or you just can’t control yourself – which is the topic of this blog afterall. (Or maybe you were doing a satire of a boorish person?)
Here we go again!!! Another anonymous blogger (laxlaxlax) speaking about integrity. What a joke. Perhaps you didn’t make the team last year or your daughter didn’t, so instead of getting out there and practicing more or coaching if you are a parent, it is a much safer bet to sit in your basement, with the lights out, so noone knows who you are and blog about the integrity of the fine coaches that VOLUNTEER their time so that the girls in the area can compete in the Empire State games.
Plllllllease, laxlaxlax in your infinite wisdom explain to me and the rest of the people how what you do on this site garners a shred of integrity and helps advance your cause or your daughters.
You are still crying about something that occurred nearly a year ago.
You sit on this site and rip into the process but offer no remedy.
Are you going to get involved this year or will you just sit and complain when it doesn’t go your way?
How would you change the process? (Every coach in the Hudson Valley is invited to evaluate and choose the team)
I am sure the coaches in the area would be open to suggestions.
Many times great athletes are overlooked for one reason or another but sitting in your basement blogging about it does nothing to address the situation.
Based on last years ridiculous entries regarding the ESG team- I have a feeling that you and people like you just like to call foul from behind the anonymity of the computer instead of being a stand up person and getting involved.
Have a great day.
Sincerely,
Mike Sullivan
Asst. Coach Suffern Girls Lacrosse
enough of this, its boring already
I believe someone previously asked if any HV girls will be playing for the national teams ?
I didn’t know there were multiple national teams. My daughter is a freshman and I was wondering how and where you try out for these ?
Tryouts for NY (all but Long Island) were held in Syracuse the third weekend in April (information about Nationals can be found on the uslacrosse.org website). A handful of girls made the cut and will attend another session in Albany, after which they will be placed on teams that are combined with the kids who made the Long Island tryout. These are known as NY1, 2, 3, etc. Graduating seniors may sign up for Senior Only slots (sometimes strongly suggested by their college coaches). Nationals tournament will be in Baltimore on Memorial Day weekend to coincide with the NCAA women’s final four tournament. It’s a great time.
RockFan – thanks for the rundown. Great information to be had by all. Let’s hope every team has great parents above them that pass down the information.
Mr. Sullivan – The first blog I ever read was last year’s blogs re: ESG. I did not have a child trying out and tried to look at the field of players objectively. I tried and I tried but I could not find it in my heart to believe that there could be so many worthy players who did not make the team. The numbers of players who played for the two volunteer coaches were staggering compared to the talent that laid cut from the team. I tend to see one, two or three, good players on each school team during a season, players that stand out above the rest. How could there not be a better mix of those top players on the ESG team? I am not being condescending, only asking. You also said to get more involved – how would you suggest that happen? I find it so disheartening that events like ESG revolve around the coaches rather than the players. How do we all put the politics aside and more forward? Maybe we should come up with a point system for each position and if you meet the goal within your regular season – you earn a place on the team. Or cap the number of players from each school team within the section to maybe two. How about we publish the evaluator names and their scores for each player trying out for the team? Not sure that any of these makes any sense or are fair – but they are suggestions and not criticisms – offers of a solution. Isn’t that what we all want? A better process for all the players. And maybe the coaches should get paid – why wouldn’t they?
How many coaches did attend the evaluations last year and can you please share who they were? Maybe we can make some positive changes before the tryouts this year.
Not sure why I have all the lines through my blog – sorry.
First of all, WGARA.
Second of all, alllax- go scratch
allLax,
I fixed the lines. FYI to everyone—don’t start a post with a dash, the computer thinks its HTML code.
all lax/ on vacation, get real, coaches want to pick kids with lesser talent, making sure more schools are playing in the Empire games just-doesn’t make sense. If Yorktown, Panas or whoever has 5 young ladies that are great players and are underclassmen- they’d make the team! Limit a team to two players, does that place the best kids in the Empires, no it doesn’t. Integrity, nepotism and politics, those words are thrown around due to the lack of ability when your daughter doesn’t make the team. Hell, bet you spent 3G on your daughter extra lax teams and the coach says she’s great and those coaches don’t have a clue when she doesn’t make the team. The coach will say anything because you’re lining their pockets. At some point you have to get a clue! Athletics doesn’t always correspond with the amount of $ paid to outside thieves. All you have to do is look at HS soccer and hockey outside clubs
If you paid that club money to an Empire coaches club or played at his HS, do you think that influences his decision. “The coach will say anything because you’re lining their pockets. At some point you have to get a clue!”
My suggestions to Mr. Sullivan on the possible ways to correct the tryout process were ridiculous at best. I vote for that the girls wear a paper bag over their head until the tryouts tallies are complete. Or we have to trust that there is a great coach who will step up advocate and make noise for the best players in the HV.
Naive? Nope. Optimistic? Always!
Rj, what does WGARA mean? I may a few acronyms for you as well.
Alllax, just tell me who should have made that team that didn’t. Who showed up and which coaches were involved in the process? These two from each team never showed.
Finally, tell me why you want affirmative action in a competition? (and i’m not talking title 9) ESG is an allstar team, just like the Olympics. Should we entertain the thought of limiting Olympic trials to 2 from each state? Even if the 20 from New York are the best in the nation? It’s a competition. Read the the state guidelines for selection. No rules were broken, the best made it. Period. The tops shools in the section had the most representatives on the team—rightfully so. Sorry some feeling were hurt but that’s life!
Tell me, who should have made it.
CTS
wow! another lax parent just told me about this blog. this is my first time, and I am very surprised. do you mean the countless hours over the years in the backyard didn’t enable my child to be successful enough to make empires and nationals? because she knows one coach, she made it? i trust that to some degree the people who i entrust the coaching of children to would have some basic integrity. and like someone earlier said, they did win the silver -couldn’t be that bad could they?
and back to the inappropriate crowds. at my child’s game the other day, it was the visiting team’s parents who were supremely out of line, I had my younger daughter there and I was saddened by the behavior she witnessed. US Lacrosse has a program where you can give unsportsmanlike fans cards which inform them they are acting like raving lunatics. we all need to remember its just a game and they are still children! AND there are young children around who do not need to be exposed to the evil maniacal behavior of whacko parents Please try to remember this next time you want to scream
Not looking for affirmative action but I am looking to take nepotism out of the equation. And by the way, I will never mention a player by name unless it is to praise them for the job they are doing on the field.
GOYS and KMYLA
GAAD
abcdefg – this is all too funny! This is why so few people blog. Bye.